淘客熙熙

主题:当我在扎针的时候我是在做什么 -- 弦音醉舸

共:💬617 🌺1617 🌵221
全看分页树展 · 主题 跟帖
家园 拿个鸡毛当令箭的典型

大多中医粉是在逻辑和知识上某一方面有缺陷。两方面都缺乏的极品也不少见。

先说逻辑,正常的逻辑应该是现有证据后得出结论;即便这篇文章如你所想的,那在这之前你什么想法?拿既有观点找证据,这和信了上帝信找神迹有神马区别?这是典型的逻辑缺陷。

再说知识,这篇文章你看得懂吗?呵呵。

外链出处

Identification of candidate anti-cancer molecular mechanisms of compound kushen injection using functional genomics

简略翻译一下:使用机能基因组学方法鉴定苦参注射液复合物中的候选抗癌分子机制

Abstract

Compound Kushen Injection (CKI) has been clinically used in China for over 15 years to treat various types of solid tumours. However, because such Traditional Chinese Medicine (TCM) preparations are complex mixtures of plant secondary metabolites, it is essential to explore their underlying molecular mechanisms in a systematic fashion. We have used the MCF-7 human breast cancer cell line as an initial in vitro model to identify CKI induced changes in gene expression. Cells were treated with CKI for 24 and 48 hours at two concentrations (1 and 2 mg/mL total alkaloids), and the effect of CKI on cell proliferation and apoptosis were measured using XTT and Annexin V/Propidium Iodide staining assays respectively. Transcriptome data of cells treated with CKI or 5-Fluorouracil (5-FU) for 24 and 48 hours were subsequently acquired using high-throughput Illumina RNA-seq technology. In this report we show that CKI inhibited MCF-7 cell proliferation and induced apoptosis in a dose-dependent fashion. We integrated and applied a series of transcriptome analysis methods, including gene differential expression analysis, pathway over-representation analysis, de novo identification of long non-coding RNAs (lncRNA) as well as co-expression network reconstruction, to identify candidate anti-cancer molecular mechanisms of CKI. Multiple pathways were perturbed and the cell cycle was identified as the potential primary target pathway of CKI in MCF-7 cells. CKI may also induce apoptosis in MCF-7 cells via a p53 independent mechanism. In addition, we identified novel lncRNAs and showed that many of them might be expressed as a response to CKI treatment.

这篇论文神马意思呢,大体思路就是用苦参注射液投与在培养的MCF-7细胞上,然后进行大范围的功能基因组学的筛查,也就是是转录组分析,包括表达谱的分析,通路的分析,lncRNA的分析和共表达网的重建等等,去找可能抗癌机制,通路等等。然后找到了一些和抗癌相关的机制和通路被活化,找到了一些被活化lncRNA等等。

这个注射液里面起码有八种主化合物,这么一大堆物质放到培养细胞上,活化了若干抗癌通路,引起凋亡等等,这倒不是什么奇怪的事情。在体外培养的细胞当中,各种各样的药物具有抑制肿瘤的作用,这样类似的文章太多了。这么一大堆物质,如果没有活化相关的通路,其实倒是比较奇怪的。作者评论,这些物质可能有协调抗癌的效果。这样一个初步的结果,作为研究来说比较难得的完成构成了这个大的表达网络,也比较花钱。

可这和真的体内抗癌是两码事,差了十万八千里,连动物实验都不是。太多的体外抗癌的药物,到动物实验没效果。至于到临床,还要比现有药物具有更佳的疗效,只能抱歉告诉中医粉们,你们想多了。

但你们其实看重的这句话:“阿德尔森说:“如果我们拆分中国传统医学药方中的成分,会发现单个成分并不会起到好的疗效。各种成分的组合才能显效,而且副作用也小。””

然而,这篇论文并不是证明这一点的。这是作者的评说,和论文的所能得出结论没多大关系。

退一万步来说,如果几种草药被证明具有协同抗癌的临床疗效,中医粉还需要用十万步来证明,这和中医理论描述的一致。

毕竟,对于中医来说,在没有现代医学的手段的情况下,如何诊断乳腺癌怕是就足够麻烦了。

全看分页树展 · 主题 跟帖


有趣有益,互惠互利;开阔视野,博采众长。
虚拟的网络,真实的人。天南地北客,相逢皆朋友

Copyright © cchere 西西河