主题：【原创】通往2012的船票 -- 万里风中虎
家园 虎大说得好 基督教的话题我不好涉及了，否则就有人追上来骂
。正计划谈谈中国社会与西方本质之不同以及经济政治观念之迥异，并从此出发如何理解目前种种现象
家园 韦伯所称的新教伦理吧 美国是清教徒建立的国家 宗教精神比旧大陆更强烈
家园 看老虎的故事费劲，没想到经济文章也看不懂了 新教将这种义务劳动是通往天堂的唯一之路发扬广大好吧，我对基督教缺乏了解，姑且当一回维基学者。
新教：
新教教义（Protestant doctrines）：
Although the doctrines of Protestant denominations are far from uniform, some beliefs extending across Protestantism are the doctrines of sola scriptura and sola fide.Sola scriptura maintains that the Bible (rather than church tradition or ecclesiastical interpretations of the Bible)[7] is the final source of authority for all Christians.
Sola fide holds that salvation comes by faith alone in Jesus as the Christ, rather than through good works.
虽然新教教派的教义远未统一，唯独圣经与唯独信心（因信称义）是新教信徒普遍遵循的教义。
唯独圣经认为，圣经（而不是教会的传统或教会的圣经诠释）[7]是所有基督徒的权力最终来源。
唯独诚意认为，拯救来自他的信仰是基督耶稣，而不是通过善行。
福音派Evangelicalism
key commitments are:The need for personal conversion (or being "born again")
Actively expressing and sharing the gospel
A high regard for biblical authority, especially biblical inerrancy
An emphasis on teachings that proclaim the death and resurrection of Jesus.[2]
福音派的主要承诺是：
个人转换（或“重生”）的必要性
积极表达和分享福音
尊重圣经的权威，尤其是圣经无误
强调宣传耶稣死而复活的教义
聖公會著名神學家巴刻（James Innell Packer[1]）曾指出基本信念：聖經的至高地位
耶穌基督的榮美
聖靈的主權
得救的必要性
佈道的優先
團契的重要
小布什所在的联合卫理公会United Methodist Church的基本信仰：
Triune God. God is one God in three persons: Father, Son and Holy Spirit (Holy Ghost).[34]
Scripture. The writings in the Old Testament and New Testament are the inspired word of God.
Sin. While human beings were intended to bear the image of God, all humans are sinners for whom that image is distorted. Sin estranges us from God and corrupts human nature such that we cannot heal or save ourselves.[35]
Salvation through Jesus Christ. God's redeeming love is active to save sinners through Jesus' incarnate life and teachings, through his atoning death, his resurrection, his sovereign presence through history, and his promised return.[35]
Sacraments. The UMC recognizes only two sacraments: Holy Baptism and Holy Communion. Other rites such as Confirmation, Ordination, Holy Matrimony, Funerals, and Anointing of the Sick are performed but are not considered sacraments. In Holy Baptism, the Church believes that "Baptism is not only a sign of profession and mark of difference whereby Christians are distinguished from others that are not baptized; but it is also a sign of regeneration or the new birth.[36] It believes that Baptism is a sacrament in which God initiates a covenant with individuals,[37] people become a part of the Church,[37] is not to be repeated,[37] and is a means of grace.[38] The United Methodist Church generally practices Baptism by sprinkling, pouring, or immersion[39] and recognizes Trinitarian formula[40] baptisms from other Christian denominations in good standing.[41] The United Methodist Church affirms the real presence of Christ in Holy Communion,[42] (the bread is an effectual sign of His body crucified on the cross and the cup is an effectual sign of His blood shed for humanity),[43] believes that the celebration is an anamnesis of Jesus’ death,[44] believes the sacrament to be a means of grace,[45] and practices open communion.[46]
Free will. The UMC believes that people, while corrupted by sin, are free to make their own choices because of God's divine grace.
Grace. The UMC believes that God gives unmerited favor freely to all people, though it may be resisted.
三围一体，圣经神圣，原罪，通过耶稣得救赎，人的自由意志，和上帝的仁爱，尽管总是被拒绝。
找了一溜，根本就找不到劳动。相反，满眼都是因信称义，因信得救，只要信主就能得救，至于你在人世间干了什么，主是不管的。用以购买“2012通往天堂的船票”的是而且只是对主的信仰，与“将生前行恶得到的金钱捐给大学和慈善机构，从而使自己一辈子的巧取豪夺, 变成了为社会发展含辛茹苦的义务劳动”是一点关系都没有的。河里有不少接触过新教的网友吧，这种观点应该不陌生吧。谁听说过做好事能得救？
政府在美国文化中具有和神一样的地位。看到这句话，我真的是无语了。不知道美国文化中神的地位是什么样的，是不是美国人总是乐于给神绑上无数的绳索进行约束仍然感到不放心？是不是美国的神父和信众一天到晚大喊大叫要“小神”不要“大神”？对了，据老虎说，人人都以为自己可以占一点神的便宜，却不知道神是以占所有人的便宜才存在的。
原来如此，神和政府确实是一样的。
－－完成－－
通宝推：玉垒关2,
本帖一共被 1 帖 引用 (帖内工具实现)家园 你搜错了 你如果搜新教教义，那出来的自然都是宗教相关的东西。新教无论如何首先是个信众的集合体，而不是义务劳动者的大联盟。你应该搜 protestance ethics 或者 puritan ethics 之类的。例如：
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protestant_work_ethic
当然老虎的文章，我也有不懂和不同意的地方。
- 复 你搜错了
家园 这回更好，多谢补充 根据维基,
However, the Calvinist and Lutheran theologians taught that only those who were predestined to be saved would be saved, by grace alone through faith in Jesus alone. Since it was impossible to know if one was predestined (since one might not receive the "grace of perseverance," and one's conversion might be only lip-service), the notion developed that it might be possible to discern that a person was elect (predestined) by observing their way of life. Hard work and frugality were thought to be two important consequences of being one of the elect; thus, protestants were attracted to these qualities, seeking to be obedient to God to whom they owed their salvation.大致上是说，加尔文和路德的教义说只有命中注定会被救赎的人可以得救，但这个命是凡人所不知道的。因为勤劳与节俭被认为是“被选中”的人的两个重要标志，所以新教徒们就通过过勤劳与节俭的生活以表明他们将要被救。所以勤劳与节俭不过是马甲而以，穿不穿在人，救不救在神：要想得救，请君勤俭
；即使勤俭，未必得救
；不用勤俭，也能得救
......你今天勤俭了吗？
家园 只有命中注定会被救赎的人可以得救 其实信上帝前是要先让你信你需要被救赎的，这点不容易啊。救赎什么呢？
家园 这帮人要自我证明 不过肯定是要先坚信自己是被神恩宠的。这种信仰的力量是很可怕的。
- 复 这帮人要自我证明
家园 基督教的传教要点就是要先信，至于为什么，你信了就可以验证 了。KAO，这不叫逻辑，叫洗脑。
为什么要信上帝？不是信佛祖或者安拉，或者春哥？
家园 宗教的确不讲究逻辑 你和他说逻辑，就是鸡同鸭讲。这个纯粹是世界观不同，没的粘合的。由此想到我们中华民族文化中最厉害的融合大法，恐怕在真正的宗教面前是没有什么大用处的，还是要按照他们的法子来。就是毛说的，不是东风压倒西风，就是西风压倒东风，胜利的办法很简单，就是把他们消灭干净，和美国人消灭印第安人一样的。有人说现在世界和谐了，不搞种族灭绝那一套了，我看不见得，能灭绝还是灭绝的好，一个不少，妇女男人小孩，全部灭掉，就真正和谐了。当然斗争的时候要讲究技巧，不能和全世界作对，要有装逼一百年的准备。
家园 这段话的意思是 得救的充要条件是蒙恩，蒙恩的充要条件是真信（by grace alone through faith in Jesus alone），真信即注定得救，归根到底还是“信”。宗教就是要你“信”。这就是唯心主义的本质。
基督教认为真心信的人有一定的外部行为模式，但模仿这种外部特征并不意味着真信。
如果说真信是原装货的话，那么那些试图通过做善事来得救的就是山寨货：－）
总的来讲，宗教是一种唯心主义信念，老话讲的好，信就有，不信就没有，有也是在人主观世界里有。以为慈善是买船票，是以为上帝是跑轮船生意的了，这完全是买卖人的理解。
家园 我感觉对人类社会的剖析，还是缠中说禅说得比较到位。 他的观点深刻些。